Why do evangelicals stink at deliverance ministry?
Working extensively in Africa doesn’t give us that option. Demons regularly show up in people and cause a ruckus. They need to be dealt with authoritatively. You can’t play patty-cake with them or ignore them. As our missionaries are discovering, they can be obnoxious and obtrusive. Lisa Smith describes her encounter with a witch doctor in Mozambique this way:“I hear the low rumblings of guttural groans. I’m not entirely sure whether this sound is coming from a human or from an animal. I open my eyes during the prayer and glance around. I see that Ana’s face is slightly contorted and these strange sounds are escaping from her lips. The rest of the congregation seems completely unphased. I asked Solomon, our translator, what had happened. He looks at me completely calm and says, “It was an evil spirit.” In a culture where witchdoctors are more prevalent than hospitals, this phenomenon is widespread.”
One woman was laying on the floor and the other was flailing about as if someone were kicking her belly. She was a 13 or 14 year old girl, who when she woke up that morning probably didn’t realize that her Sunday- best outfit would be getting torn and dirty on a church floor as she wailed.
The parishioners and pastor were doing their best to lead the girl to deliverance, but not much progress had been made since the girl had now been wailing for about 30 minutes. My curiosity got the best of me and I found myself inching closer and closer to the victim. Eventually, I was kneeling next to her and what I saw….
This precious girl’s eyes were not that of a child. Glazed over and red they pointed straight up as if they were not allowed to look anywhere else. Between the screams she would growl and between the growls and screams she horrifyingly spat out shrieks drenched in fear. When I asked my teammates for help in describing her shrieks, the most common answer was like that of a woman being raped. I don’t know that any of us have actually heard a woman in this condition but the sound was as if her core were being violated and violently ripped from her being.
Pointing his finger in her face the Pastor shouted, “In the Name of Jesus come OUT!” The demon didn’t listen. He did this several times and then he made eye contact with me that said, “Your turn.”
I didn’t know what to do. What can you do? But something in me was ready. I was made for this. To give Jesus to people in torment! Looking at her I wondered what her name was. Asking the Pastor he informed me that it was Beatrice. With that I tried to see her how Jesus saw her. What did he think of her and if He were here, what would he say? I didn’t used demonology terminology because I don’t know how to. Looking her in the eyes I said, “You are Beatrice. You are a child of God. He calls you beautiful.” Jerking from side to side she lashed back at me in a freaky low grunt, “I am not Beatrice. Beatrice doesn’t want to be delivered.”
That was enough to jumpstart my faith. A demon was trying to talk to me like I was going to listen to it…Right. Continuing to watch her God dropped something in my Spirit. Ask her to go back to the time before she was abused. To the time when she was pure and untouched. I grabbed her little face and softly spoke what I was told to speak in her ear and as I did so the congregation continued to worship in song. Immediately…Instantly…Abruptly…. as soon as the last word was spoken her entire body appeared to fall asleep.
We all kind of looked around at each other, none of us knowing what to do next. Was it over? The Pastor decided to answer our curiosity by opening her eyes for her. As he did so her eyes moved side to side and alas…a little girl woke up. Her name was Beatrice and she was as gentle as a lamb. I helped sit her up and we walked her through a prayer, her voice so soft and sweet. She had absolutely no idea that a few minutes prior she had growled at me.
was absolutely stunning, fully delivered, bright, beautiful and quiet
tempered as ever.”
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Thanks for sharing this; we are a counseling / deliverance ministry this is valuable information! Most evangelicals (like most of the church) “stink” at this because they haven’t been properly trained or are unwilling to flail about and let things get a little messy. We train people in a reasonable, thorough and balanced process approach that helps them be effective in this.
Can i perform deliverance on myself. If possible, how? What are the processes and procedures?
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Deliverance was designed to do what nothing else will and is the FIRST sign that Jesus listed would follow them that believe.
The demon you don’t cast out is the demon that will take you out if it can in a body bag and then go after your family who survive you.
Armchair Quarterbacks and Critics and Deliverance Dropout and Wimpy Warriors are in abundance but there are FEW that will report fr duty and stand in the gap and FIGHT! for the souls of men and women bound up and tied up by demons.
Thank God for the Generals who have come before and who paid a high price to carry 1/3 of Jesus Christ Ministry across the world.
Pastor Win Worley, Derek Prince, Jim Croft, Charles Holzhauser, Ivory Hopkins and many more
God called me back to america in 2010 from Costa Rica and had me start up a Full Gospel Deliverance Internet Radio which attacks the Hosts of Hell in Jesus Christ Name and is training up and equipping the saints to do battle with the Hosts of Hell.
Join me at http://www.omegamanradio.com where I bring together deliverance ministries from around the globe to teach and preach.
I currently have a beachhead operation in Bali Indonesia – The Island of Demons and we broadcast worldwide daily
This is great confirmation for me. I just had a meeting with the leadership of a church that I am a volunteer youth leader for… and they are asking me to head up a prayer/healing ministry for the kids. And I know that a lot of it is actually going to be deliverance. I am not sure they know that…. but I believe I must trust God to have my back and boldly move forward to help these kids get free!
My first experience of deliverance ministry was being pinned to a bed by the leader of a team I worked on at the time, while he and a whole group of other people shouted in my face, telling something to “come out in the name of Jesus.” It was a devastating and horrific experience. When they thought they had done, they walked away and left me lying there alone while they ministered to the girl on the team who had “prophetically” pointed her finger at me.
25 years on, God has brought me through both ministry to me and used me in ministry for other people and I have learned that demons are not things you shout at – that’s entirely unnecessary and they will just laugh at you if you do. Often forgiveness or repentance will get rid of their right to be there as they tend to gain access through a trauma or a rebellious choice. And Jesus is always but always stronger and their power was ended on the cross. And that’s your authority. Not volume but truth.
I don’t hold with people who are rude and disrespectful in their words and attitudes towards demons – Jude warns about those who “slander celestial beings” and tells the story about even the archangel Michael “when he was disputing with the devil about the body of Moses, did not dare to bring an accusation against him but said ‘the Lord rebuke you.’” Don’t give ’em any truck and kick them out, absolutely. That’s what Jesus did. But He always cared for the individual life. It’s a person you are ministering to, not a demon. Experiences like mine can be avoided if you remember that. I could have been set free a whole lot sooner than I was and personally, I don’t want anyone captive to the enemy a moment longer than they have to be.
Love Marisa’s story there. Perfect. She listened to what God told her to do and obeyed His instruction when the demon was manifesting in that lovely girl and as a result, she was delivered. We need to get braver, read the Word again and do what Jesus did. After all, it is part of the commission Christ gave us (Mark 16:15-18) and there are a lot of captives out there.
Carol-
Your experience makes an important point – there is a dearth of teaching about deliverance and the prophetic in the church today (both the evangelical and charismatic wing). I am sorry for the trauma of your experience. Youth groups can be like snake pits as their leaders work the kids into a frenzy of demon slayers. However, I do think this abuse was more prevalent in the 1980s and 1990s, and now the opposite has happened, where it’s largely been abandoned by the church as a whole.
Yet, the demons are still at work in their subtle, deceitful ways amping up the desires of our sin drenched flesh, and the internal chatter of our minds. Your experience demonstrates the need for teaching in the gifts of the Spirit (discernment here) because you can’t cast the flesh out of the flesh. Even after deliverance, we still have a sinful nature to grapple with. Seth’s experience demonstrates the utter simplicity of deliverance ministry, when done right, and the tremendous power we have with seasoned faith in the power of Jesus wonderful Name.
Andrew
I was involved in the “deliverance” ministry in Germany 1974-77 with Derick Prince, Don Basham, Bob Mumford, etc… Our group firmly believed in demonic activity and we were constantly exposed to deliverance sessions. All of the Christian groups I have been involved with over the last 35 years have believed in deliverance ministry. Some have been crazy about it, others kinda of mediocre – but it has still been there. So, I have been through many deliverance sessions – on both sides of the chair 😉
I agree with Carol though on repentance…it is the key of hope. Also, I do not argue with demons…the Bible says these signs shall follow them that believe “….cast out demons…” The Russian churches I minister with are very INVOLVED in deliverance ministry. I help there, but I do not shout, or get crazy, or even hold people down(too much like Sceva the Jew’s sons). I allow the person to call on the name of Jesus – it says he will save them. I would be more than willing to share a great experience about a recent deliverance(too long for this, but mighty). I believe that inner healing(another lost Christian ministry) is vital to see deliverance be real and healing. I know of Carol’s experience where you feel like the demon yourself. I guess I believe that if that legion of demons hasn’t been cast out of me by now…what hope have I? I mean really, I don’t think the Gestapo or KGB stand a candle to some of these “Deliverance Ministers.”
I want to add wisdom here though for all of us…let us know that we can cast the demons out/away from us everyday. And that ONLY the Holy Spirit possesses us as believers in Jesus Christ. I pray for all of us who have experienced and are experiencing deliverance – Jesus and Father God love us very much and are interested in out total healing. Deliverance, dear believers is not a bad thing…even if you have been hurt by it….it is not who defines you – JESUS does.
I wish I could say more, but I want to be kind of brief, yeah, I wasn’t. This subject needs so much though…because of ignorance of those who don’t believe it and those who did it the wrong way and wounded people.
an added note: you don’t have to go to Africa to see demons manifesting. Go to Wal-Mart, on US highways,or even church on Sundays… Wouldn’t it be great if we would start at “home?”
Hey St. Mark on the Cross –
Regarding your offer: “I would be more than willing to share a great experience about a recent deliverance (too long for this, but mighty).”
Please do post it. Very interested in the testimony.
Ever read the book “Visions Beyond the Veil” ?
Andrew
VISIONS BEYOND THE VEIL
by H. A. BAKER
Missionary to Tibet, China, and Formosa
Download here:
http://files.biddenhelpt.net/us_Visions_beyond_the_Veil.pdf
Visions Beyond The Veil provides a fascinating insight into Heaven and the spiritual battle that is going on around us. It is designed to open your eyes to the spiritual blessings God has prepared for every believer in Christ.
H.A. Baker is survived by his grandson Rolland Baker. Rolland and his wife, Heidi, are currently missionaries to Mozambique and they run an orphanage there. Some of the “naughty” children in this orphanage have had visions where they met Jesus and were told to stop sinning and preach the gospel. When a disruptive child has this type of vision, it results in a drastic change in their behavior. Also, a revival has broken out in the nation of Mozambique under the supervision of Rolland and Heidi Baker, which has resulted in over 5,000 churches being planted. If you would like to know more about Rolland Baker and Iris Ministries, please see their www page at http://www.irismin.org .
per Bro. Andrew’s request…here is the testimony of recent deliverance at Russian Church Jesus Encounter weekend.
Jesus Encounter is a spiritual retreat weekend with various teachings including deliverance. My blessed Russian brethren do deliverance the “traditional” way – lots of shouting, and hours of exorcism. I had finished my teaching on the love of Father God, and was over at the fabulous Russian meal time, when I was asked to come back over to the meeting hall. Before I got there, I heard the screams and shouting. When I got inside, a small framed African descendant young women, early 20’s was on the floor. She was moving around like a serpent, or wild animal, and there was screaming and yelling going on from both sides. So, I proceeded to pray and worship the Lord, to be honest quite relaxed in loving and talking to Father & Jesus. There were around 8 ministers praying and holding the young lady down, as she wriggled about and screamed. I kept praying “Father, please let her be free by your love.” Truthfully, my heart was broken… Well, this went on for about 15 minutes, and then the Russian Pastor of a church asked me to pray. I want to add here that these Russian brethren are precious, having gone through hell with the KGB and Soviet oppression prior to coming to USA. This young lady was frothing at mouth, screaming with mouth that was wide like a alligator. I looked down at her and started to tell her(not the demon) that Father God in heaven and Jesus loved and cared for her. Oh, by the way…I did not even try to hold her down. Maybe I am ignorant of scripture here, but I find no model of this type of thing in the word of God. It doesn’t say “…these signs shall follow those who believe, they shall hold people down, and then cast out devils…” She looked at me and stared directly in my eyes… And they were still holding her down…. I then told her that Jesus in her loved her and was here for her… I then held her hand, and she slowed down the moaning and yelling. I told her to call on the name of Jesus, as she was a believer. I kept reassuring he that Father and Jesus loved her. Then the word of the Lord came to me, and I told her to forgive – she started screaming and crying, but the Holy Spirit gave me power in Jesus name. I rebuked the devil and started speaking to her inner man of God. I told her that her Father wants her free and she has right to be free. The more I spoke, not soft, but no yelling – the more she freed up. And then she spoke the name JESUS – and calmness fell on her. No more shouting, screaming, frothing, and wiggling around on the floor – her eyes cleared up and it was over. She then went and ate with us, and started to worship and praise God at next session an hour later. Also, I did not tell the demon 100 times to leave.
This event has occurred many times in deliverance sessions at church meetings. I don’t fight with demons…I believe the real battle is us. We are the ones who need the convincing of the power of Jesus name. The power of Jesus name really rests in the knowledge of Jesus being the son of God, who has empowered us by his nature of life and spirituality. I find the more I believe in God and Jesus Christ, the more spiritual authority I have over the devils, flesh, and any adversity. I stopped trying to convince the devils to leave and starting “convincing” myself of the true power of Jesus Christ. And I did not need to puke in a Kentucky Fried Chicken bucket as I have known some to do. Sometime, maybe I will write a blog about my experiences over the years with deliverance ministry – I am more prone to inner healing ministry though because I believe it is what the Lord does when he sets the captive ones freehe heals the broken in heart and binds up their wounds, putting us in the gap as prayer warriors, and loving brethren to cover each other and pray in the name of Jesus – really believing that there is power in the name of Jesus.
We are loved by our Father and accepted in his beloved kindness and saved by our wonderful Jesus – therein is the power you need to know when casting out devils and (flesh).
Brother Andrew…have not read the book, but will try to find it. Thanks, and Jesus bless you so dearly today. Isn’t Jesus wonderful!
St. Mark of the Cross-
Regarding your testimony of deliverance… Very inspiring and patient courage on your part to let Jesus be incontrol as you trust to even be called forward. That is something I am learning in another part of my life.
IMHO, how right on you are about faith working through love, and not in the shouting. I think both deliverance ministers and the demons like the drama, the spectacle. It’s wrong, and takes the focus off Jesus. While the shouting works, I think it does so only because that is where the ministers faith is resident. But it is not necessary, and not scriptural, as you so aptly point out (not that it’s anti-scriptural to be so dramatic). Maybe you should do a blog!
Personally, I do not try/want to talk to demons. Discernment of spirits while show me what I need to know when I need to know it. When demons put on the drama, I speak this scripture to silence them, “Be silent all flesh, before the LORD…” Zechariah 2:13
*** you can download the book VISIONS BEYOND THE VAIL at this link:
http://files.biddenhelpt.net/us_Visions_beyond_the_Veil.pdf
Hi guys, really helpful stuff here from you, Andrew and Mark. Thanks.
I absolutely agree, Andrew, it is the demons that love the drama -it’s distracting, even frightening and deliberately so. Like the scripture you use – good one!
My friend Michelle has a hugely powerful ministry in this area and there is no drama, no holding people down, no shouting. Sometimes you can barely hear her speak, she speaks so quietly. I have often heard her say “out you come now in the name of Jesus, out on the next natural breath…….thank You Lord” in about the same tone as she would offer me a cup of tea……but the demons flee because she knows her authority in Christ. She knows the truth, she doesn’t need to get loud and excited about it, she just speaks the word and they go.
She also listens very very carefully to what God tells her and He hands her key after key that only He would know about in the person’s life. Her whole aim is always, as you say Mark, inner healing. To set the person free and focus them on Jesus. And then she helps them walk it out in any way that may be appropriate. As you say, Andrew, you still have a sinful nature to grapple with after deliverance. You have to take the steps forward and keep on walking in your freedom, one step at a time.
Good stuff on here today guys – thanks!
Love Carol xxx
“Sticking our heads in the sand is hardly a strategy for taking on an enemy that wants to kill us.”
you are right…this is absolutely true…AMEN!!
Great dialog! Love it. Thank you for sharing all the sides here for those of us who are still finding our way.
Thanks for the link of the book…brother Andrew! It is so appreciated. Thank all of you for sharing your hearts so we can all grow together as Jesus beautiful and holy body! Special note to my dear sister Carol…I did not share of my own tragedy with deliverance sessions, because I have forgiven them – knowing that many times in our zeal to serve Jesus, we get carried away. Truly, it was crazy at times, just as it is so with us when we get away from the simple devotion to loving Father God & Jesus, our beloved savior. I encourage all of us to really care for each other, and “talk” about our lives in Jesus. And let us start believing in our own lives, casting out the devils who tell us that we are not of our wonderful Father and blessed Jesus. More conversations with Father & Jesus, causes less dialouge with the devil and his troops. Wasn’t it the Archangel who simply said “…the Lord rebuke thee…?”
Carol, here is some encouragement for you on the note of “slander celestial beings”.Recently whilst talking about the word of God and the truth to someone they suddenly changed and became very aggresive and angry yelling at me to shut up. I knew that I was no longer talking to the person but a demon.I was on my own, I am not a very big person I am a very pettite female and the person was a large male but I was not afraid, in fact I beacame very indignant at this demons attitude, so much so I actually swore at it just before I bound it and gagged it!I was just so annoyed that it dare talk to me like that!
God immediently convicted me and I had to repent of my use of language towards it! The person that the demon was in cant really remember what happened other than when I bound it they suddenly felt a “pulling” in their spirit like something just shrinking inside them.
Our fight is not against flesh and blood thats for sure. I have lost count the amount of demons I have seen (and angels, its not just one sided)In fact when I was went to see “Lord of the Rings” and that big demon at the end grabbed Mr G I was impressed that someone had done their homework! Ive seen things like that!And this is all in the UK not some African country!
We have been born into a spritual war that has been raging for thousands of years but many christians are in the middle of the battlefield getting slaughtered with no armour on and no awareness of the enemy nor his tactics.Then the church wonders why it is in the state it is!
Dear all I am new to internet discussions, but would just say it is so refreshing to share with brothers and sisters that are also working at restoring the Body of Jesus, restoring them with a love that flows from the throne room, yes I have been in the deliverance ministry for 26 yrs and yes many errors were made, but as we endure, and continue to rightly divide the word of God, therefore being able to discern correctly, I pray for a time when all believers will not be so afraid but as David before Goliath will be offended with the arrogance the devil has and begin to pluck the people out of his clutches, instead they as David’s brothers stand by and look and listen, let’s be obedient I am 4ft and 11 inc tall and God has always protected me, let believe, Greetings in Jesus Christ our deliverer.
I feel an Evangelist should be gifted on all ministry’s. Not just teaching and preaching but Deliverance, healing and all gifting in order to have full 5 fold. If for some reason they just are not able. Then they should have able bodied people with them who can carry this side of it. It sounds like deep training in needed and a mind sit to learn different things. I understand everyones gifts are different. But that is why others are neededd in the body of Christ to help out.. All hands,arms,feet,legs, are needed to ran the head and brain.. In Unity Prayer and fasting is the key together. God Bless
The problem is very few christian ministers have had direct personal experience of their own long term deliverance and the walking in faith which comes by daily reading of the word and prayer.
They are not qualified through experiential knowledge adequately to be able to offer the correct information, support and guidance to those suffering from demon possession or manifestations. There is ignorance because very few people in the church wish to learn about How demons work to enter and afflict people and they don’t understand how the devil and his wiles are to be resisted in order to affect healing.
The first thing to tell those afflicted, is that they need to take responsability for their own development of faith.
No good preaching the word to them, they must read it daily themselves and must understand that certain life changes have to be made so that sin can be dealt with.
God will not keep asnwering prayers for healing if the one receiving deliverance does not remain in rightstanding with him.
It’s important also to know the truth about the gifts of the holy spirit which were received by the apostles at pentecost. These gifts allowed those men and woman to cast out sin directly in those who were possessed or oppressed. Those men and women had the POWER and AUTHORITY of God on account of their righteousness before God. This is not the case today, but instead we have men and women who venture into deliverance ministry without the POWER of God, which makes them in truth powerless to effect any kind of lasting relief of healing amongst those they are trying to help.
I suggest that you read “Secrets of Spiritual warfare” by Penn-Lewis to learn about the pitfalls which Satan uses to hinder people in their quest for healing and relief.
Calvery greeting in the name of our Jesus christ. I am the G.O.of Deliverance Manifestion of Christ Ministries,Intl. I am a delivance minister here in nigeria, i ll like to affilate with ur ministry to pull down the the stroughold of the enemy (devil). To fulfil the great commisions of christ. My focus is to reach at to people through the gospel of Jesus to change people lifes. I believe in holiness and righteouiness. we will like to affilate with your ministries, we will need your help in any way you know you can support us God will bless you. I am looking forward to ur response. tel:- +234 083 777 1500. email pastorcyril2005@yahoo.com Thanks u and God bles u. From Pastos Cyril
love this article, would like more info or connection..This is the ministry God has called me too.
Thanks for the information, it is really good for us to be trained in these areas of deliverance.
Can i perform deliverance on myself. If possible, how? What are the processes and procedures
Peace to you, Freda!
Here are two Bible-based, self-helpful books:
The Bondage Breaker
by Neil T. Anderson & Rich Miller
Freedom From Fear, Overcoming Worry & Anxiety
by the same author
The second one is mainly on overcoming all kinds of fears, and building our faith/trust in God and His Christ.
God bless you and build you up!
Lisa
Since the Lord Jesus first commissioned His original disciples and gave them permission to use some of His awesome power to preach the Gospel, heal the sick and cast out demons, there have been amazing testimonies recorded. Then the Lord Jesus instructed His disciples to help transfer that same power to continually make more disciples in each succeeding generation. There has always been a true remnant carrying on the work of the Lord Jesus/Yeshua throughout history. For example that the Lord gave us as disciples in Luke 10:19,” Behold, I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you.”
This means you have authority in Jesus name which is amazingly good news. In these last days we really must do what we are called to do here. Hebrews 12:27,” And this word, Yet once more, signifieth the removing of those things that are shaken, as of things that are made, that those things which cannot be shaken may remain.” This refers to the renovation of the Heaven and earth, because at the end of the millennium all those things that came in with the curse and all those unholy man made things which need to go will be vanquished so the Lord may remain and enjoy what He wants here eternally in holiness.
In the meantime we know it says in Roman 11:5,” Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.” Mercy, grace and love, Papa God amazing grace extends and elects all that will believe. Just as the Jews were saved by grace and not because of connection to a covenant of works. If it is by works then it ceases to be free and unmerited gift of our Lord Jesus salvation for us. Amen, because I see the remnant is rising up in these end times.
I believe the Holy Ghost is saying to us today as He did to ancient Israel that even though there are giants in the land it is time to invade, it is time to occupy and influence this world for Christ. We who are suppose to be more then mere conquerors let us get on with the assignment. Even if you feel like a grasshopper, besides it not about feelings its about obeying the Lord at His Word. Let us band together and pray and believe the Word of God until we see the victory. Considering most miracles are in our mouth and need to be released in Jesus name for something to happen. Mark 16: 17,” And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
18 They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.”
As part of the Remnant you have been authorized for spiritual conquest and that means occupation, we take back what the devil stole. By the way there are no seeker friendly messages anywhere to be found in the entire Holy Bible so who do think has encouraged such churches to exist today? If this is really your best life now, what shall your life in the next world be? I pray the Lords supernatural peace, healing, provision and protection cover you always with oceans of Agape love in the almighty name of Jesus/Yeshua!
PASTOR CASPAR
Amen, Caspar! Let’s exercise the authority already delegated to us.
wow, its almost a year since I posted the above and now I can answer my own question. We CAN cast demons out of ourselves! It has been quite a learning curve and I have been truly blessed to have the support and prayer of Deon, Seth, Grant and Clint but I am so thankful for the power and the Name and the blood of the Lord Jesus. I have learned that it is about having faith in the authority of the Lord Jesus. No shouting or drama. I just whisper now: Unclean spirit I cast thee out in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ. I believe a number of demons have now been cast out. Only one remains but manifestations are rare. I pray every day for complete deliver ance. Its is a wonderful, faith building experience when the demons obey you in the precious Name of Jesus. But we should rather rejoice that our names are written in heaven.
That’s wonderful to hear, Derek! What an arduous struggle it was, too. Just finding someone nearby who would pray with you seemed impossible.
I’m so thankful that we were able to persevere and help get you free!
Now you own that freedom – it is yours to share.
God bless you.
Hi Carol, do you do deliverance in the UK at all? Is there any way of getting in touch with you to chat please? Thank you